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Small Business Bestie
Entrepreneurship is hard, and sometimes we could use a friend to walk a mile in our shoes. Small Business Bestie is here to provide that friendship, support, and inspiration that small business owners need from time to time.
Small Business Bestie
43: BONUS: Davonna Saier is the ultimate Bestie!
What happens when a business interview transforms into a soul-nourishing conversation about life's most challenging transitions? Michelle Smock sits down with Davonna Saier of Davonna INClusive for what quickly becomes an intimate dialogue on navigating personal change, standing in your values, and finding strength during politically turbulent times.
This raw and unfiltered conversation opens with Michelle's candid disclosure about her separation and life changes. Rather than glossing over the hard parts, both women dive deep into how our current political climate affects our relationships, mental health, and business decisions. Together they explore what it means to honor your values even when it feels impossibly difficult.
"Exhaustion is not a status symbol," Davonna reminds us, challenging the hustle culture that permeates entrepreneurship. She shares practical wisdom through her "less and more" list – actionable shifts like padding time in your schedule, practicing gratitude before writing to-do lists, and creating intentional boundaries around social media consumption. Her mantra "relax, nothing is in control" offers a paradoxical comfort for uncertain times.
The conversation ventures into physical wellness too, with Davonna advocating for hormone testing and sharing how discovering her low testosterone levels transformed her quality of life. Both women discuss the importance of finding supportive communities like Small Business Besties, where vulnerability is welcomed and authentic connections flourish.
Whether you're navigating a major life transition, feeling the weight of our political climate, or simply seeking permission to prioritize your wellbeing, this episode reminds you that you're not alone. As Michelle says, "the whole point of Small Business Besties was to provide an authentic space for women to connect" – and this episode delivers exactly that. Reach out if you need support – we're all in this together.
Connect with Davonna:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/davonna-saier-56315228/
Check out Jessica Upchurch King's Gratitude materials here and her non-profit YOU ARE here which is what inspired the chatter about Uganda.
Check out the Small Business Bestie Website
Follow along on the Small Business Bestie Pod Facebook
Join the growing community on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/smallbusinessbesties
Connect with Michelle on Facebook at https://www.facebook.com/bestiemichellesmock
Check out the Small Business Bestie Website
Season two of Small Business Besties starts now. I'm your host, michelle Smock, and before we get into today's episode, I wanted to take just a minute and talk to you guys about some things that I've alluded to. I feel like most of you guys are my friends. I know you personally. I'm so honored to be on this journey of entrepreneurship with you all, and so I want to just be as transparent as possible, because I feel like, especially in the current climate that we're in, we will say it's really important that we feel like we have true connections, and that's what I feel with the Small Business Bestie community is that this isn't just a podcast for me, it isn't just a Facebook group. For me, it isn't just trying to get my business out in front of people. Small Business Besties has literally became my family here in Kentucky. The women that I've met on this journey are truly my family here, in fact. I'll just get into it.
Speaker 1:Most of you guys probably have heard at this point that my husband and I are separating. We just got to a point where we don't see things in the same way anymore, and I feel like, in this time that we're in, it's really important that you stand firm in what you believe and what your values are and which direction you feel led to go, and at this point in time our directions were no longer in alignment. So I have left that relationship. I moved out of my family's home. We're doing like 50-50 custody with the kids. So everything is new and different and it feels really scary in my personal life right now. But I'll tell you guys just completely honestly, a lot of those shifts in my personal life came from the fact that things are so insane in our political climate right now. I'm just going to put it on the table.
Speaker 1:So the recording that you guys are about to hear I recorded with Devana from Devana Inclusive. We recorded this. I think it was maybe the day after the inauguration. There were this flurry of executive orders and all of these things felt very unsafe and chaotic and scary and all of the things. And although I love Devana as an entrepreneur and she's an amazing leader and she has so much knowledge and wisdom to share with women entrepreneurs when she got to my house that day to record the episode, it honestly just became a counseling session for me and she was so kind and so raw and so real and our conversation was like two squirrels just running around the yard together. We were everywhere in that conversation and I really debated about whether or not I should release that episode because it's so atypical from what a Small Business Bestie episode usually sounds like, feels like, etc.
Speaker 1:And after a long time of contemplating about it I've realized that you know, davana and I were very real and honest with one another in that conversation and that's what we need right now is we need other humans, especially women. We need our women to speak to one another, to speak into one another, to listen to each other, to know that we've got each other's backs, even if we don't see eye to eye on things politically or whatever, knowing that you have a community of women who can support one another and be there and really be, you know, sisters, family, friends. I'm just I'm blown away by the amount of support that I've received from the Small Business Bestie community as I've transitioned through all of the changes in my life recently. So I just wanted to kind of give that disclaimer. I really hope that you all feel like small business besties is a place where not only you get business support but where you're getting support from other women. And if you don't feel that way, reach out to me, because that's what I'm looking for in my life, and if I'm not the right person to support you or love on you, I probably know somebody who is, and I can get you connected, and that's honestly. The biggest joy in my life is being able to connect women with the right people in their lives for where they are what they need. So please don't hesitate to reach out if you are feeling alone or scared or you need anything, whether it's business or personal. I'm your girl. Reach out to me, let me know.
Speaker 1:So, with all of that on the table, season two is going to look a little different. I had high hopes for what was going to happen. I'm taking a step back from the big, big dreams that I had, not because I don't think I can do it, but because right now I have to take care of me, and taking care of me right now means that I'm going to be a little less aggressive in my professional life than maybe I've been in the past, and that's perfectly okay. So I'm going to go a little slower. I'm going to take things as they come. I'm still offering business coaching, so if anybody needs a business coach, I'm your girl, reach out to me, but I'm not going to hit the pavement hard and try to sell my booty off or anything like that. I'm going to honor where I am in my journey right now, and I encourage all of you to do the same thing to take stock of where am I and how much energy, how much time, how much money, you know, can I devote to whatever it is, whether it's your business, your hobby, you know whatever.
Speaker 1:So I guess what I'm trying to say is the whole point of Small Business Besties was to provide an authentic space for women to connect, and if I'm not being authentic, then what the heck are we doing here? So I just wanted to be really transparent and real with you guys and to tell you how much it has meant to me to have the support of this community. I hope that you enjoy all of the guests of season two. We're going to kick off with a bonus episode from Devana that we recorded a couple of months ago, and then I'll release that episode with Azra that I know a lot of you guys are looking forward to, and then season two is just packed full of amazing women entrepreneurs from across the country, and I'm so excited to bring that to you. So thanks so much as always for being a part of this. And here's to us. Devana Sayer, with Devana Inclusive, is having a chat with me today and the timing is perfect perfectly imperfect, if you will so I'm very excited to have you here, so happy to be here.
Speaker 2:So I have to show you look what I wore. Do you remember that? I do remember this. Okay, y'all, I'm showing a slap bracelet when I met Michelle at Women Leading, kentucky. I love all your 80s branding, I love it. I'm a child of the 80s myself and you gave me this slap bracelet and I've had it in my car ever since.
Speaker 1:I love that so much. That's the day I ordered a shirt specific for that event that said all that and a bag of chips.
Speaker 2:Yeah, girl, that's what we used to say. We were so cool All that. What is it? Been there done that coolest? We still are, and I love this slap bracelet. So, thank you, I hope your life is as fun as a slap bracelet girl.
Speaker 1:I'm just going to slap myself around until it is.
Speaker 2:Maybe that's what I'm missing. Are we trying to in 2025? Like, can we just? You know, I wish, I wish y'all could be a fly on the wall to hear us when I first got here, because we got real deep real quick and I'm grateful for that.
Speaker 2:Welcome to my lair, let's step in a bunch of shit. Let's just step in some shit. Yeah, it's okay. It's okay. So let me tell you about Devana Inc first. Yes, please do. Okay. So I left the corporate world in 2022.
Speaker 2:It was very difficult for me. Thought I had. My dream job Was an executive director of a senior living community. Thought I would be there. You, until I retired, loved the residents and families I served. It was just. It was so wonderful.
Speaker 2:And unfortunately, I got to a point where it was so incredibly corporate driven and I was being asked to do things that I just couldn't do in my soul. I knew were not right. And it was the hardest thing I've ever had to do professionally and that was walk away and put in my 30 day resignation letter. They walked me out that day because they were worried I was going to go to the competition. It was an affirmation, but it was really hard and I was really at a point where I had to prioritize self-discovery every day to figure out what the heck I was going to do next.
Speaker 2:I was fortunate that my life partner was very supportive, you know, and I had friends who I couldn't live without, which we can talk about in a little bit, because having a good circle or, as we like to say, horseshoe because we don't like to be exclusive, we want to always let people in our circle right. Having a good horseshoe of friends to get you through those times is so, so important. But I started Devana Inclusive mainly the word inclusive, because there's so much that goes in Devana. There's a lot of layers of me and I'm proud to say that there's a lot of things I love. I'm multi-passionate and I wanted to be able to just really support women, especially in the marketing world, because that comes easy to me and I'd had a lot of experience in that. I wanted to still maybe work in some elder care and, you know, just help women lead. But we talk so much about women being empowered and I think that's very important. We should always try to empower, but I think even more let's take it another step and let's prioritize women.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I want women to feel prioritized and know that they are, and we need to work in a world and in a country that does that. And Lord, have mercy. We're being challenged now.
Speaker 1:We are being challenged in ways that, yeah, they feel unreal sometimes, but I think that what you're trying to do with Devana Inc is so admirable because it's not only to, like you said, empower women, but also like okay, so you feel empowered now, but you have to have the skills, you have to have the knowledge, you have to have the resources to be able to use that power.
Speaker 2:Yes, Right, yes, and I want to be what 22 year old Devonna needed. You know, I want to be that person and I'm finally I don't know there's something about turning 40. I turned 40 last year. I'm getting ready to turn 41. It's my birthday week Again. I'm so glad this podcast was rescheduled because we needed each other today.
Speaker 1:Oh, I will. I've been 41. Thank you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because in a few days, I'll turn 41. But I feel like I have. You know, I still have so much to learn, and my 2025 word is wisdom, because I just can't learn enough right now. I just want to put so much in my brain and sometimes I have to just kind of put it on pause and rest, but I want so badly to just take what I've learned and help other women know their value.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that is so important, and I take for granted sometimes that I had a badass mom that continued to tell me that I could do anything a man could do and that I could do anything that I set my mind to, and it's been really interesting, though, as an entrepreneur, because we deal with that not good enough, you know, not reaching this milestone or not. What do I need to do here? And the great thing about being an entrepreneur is you can change your mind any day, go whatever direction you want, right, but you're selling yourself, being able to have a brand that's pink and sparkly and women empowering, and all of that. Like what?
Speaker 1:an honor, that is.
Speaker 2:It's fun. There are some days, though, you and I've talked about that. I'm just like I just need to go get a nine to five job. It's because putting in the work as an entrepreneur and selling yourself and constantly rediscovering and reinventing yourself is hard, but I think what you are doing with the small business besties is so important because we're not alone. We need to lean on each other.
Speaker 1:We need to help each other, and that's what's happening with your community, michelle, and I'm so proud of you and I'm so proud to be part of it. Thank you, I'm so grateful to have so many people a part of it and willing to collaborate and work together. Today's a perfect example. When you and I finish here, I'm going to a vision board. Yes, I didn't really have to lift a finger for this thing. I reached out to another small business bestie, shout out to Kim McGinnis, and I said hey, I saw that you had hosted a vision board workshop a couple of months ago. I'd really like to do something like that for the small business besties. And she said hold my beer and just took off. Yes, made it all happen. The only thing I have to do is pick up a little snack tray and show up Perfect and that's going to be so therapeutic for you.
Speaker 2:It's important that we visualize where we want to be and what we want and through Devana Inc, I've done a couple engagements lately mood boarding, professional mood boarding. I've been hired, which has been so fun. I've been hired by some leaders to come into their business and help them. We call it professional horizons mood boarding and I bring in all the supplies and we talk about and they say how they want to show up for their co-workers and show up professionally. And you know, a lot of times things tie in personally, because there is no such thing as worst life balance, because some days it's 80-20, some days it's 50-50. But it's been so good because then we can follow up with what affirmations can we hold ourselves accountable for? We can ask these people that you're going to do vision boards with today. They're going to know the rest of the year how they can support you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, how wonderful is that.
Speaker 2:I love that. How wonderful is that if you share and I always make people share one element from their mood board or their vision board. Mood is more the essence and the spirit and, like colors and stuff, you know, vision to me are more tangible things Like what do you want to see, purchases or trips, and you know those sort of goals.
Speaker 1:I may transition my vision tonight into a move.
Speaker 2:How do you want to show up? And you know, when I'm walking people through this and I just I think it's so important that, as women, we are empowered to create our own reality. And I ask people to close their eyes and say don't judge anything that comes into your head, but what colors make you happy? What textures are you drawn to? You know what visions are you? Just just get you excited, put that on the board and go with it. Yeah, things come out that they don't even know why they come out. You know, but there's something in there that that needs to be brought to the surface and to be able to do that with a group, you know, especially if you have a little wine or charcuterie or whatever it's going to take. It's so important to have that self-reflection. So kudos to you for going to that.
Speaker 1:I'm super excited. I've never done an event quite like that. You know, I don't know if you guys know this about me, but for a period of my life I was pretty woo-woo yeah, girl about the week crystals and I was a yoga teacher and you know I did all the things and so there was a lot of like I'm blank on the word for some reason right now, but like I'm visualizing, you know what do I want? Manifesting? You know manifesting and all of those things. But to be honest, like disclaimer, okay, the past couple of years I've been so wrapped up in just like hustle, hustle, hustle, make things go that I haven't really spent the time to do that.
Speaker 2:Talk about the word hustle because it used to be a positive word to me and I thought I needed to do it and now I don't like it. Now I think about hustling already always good, you got to have the right balance of hustle yeah you know, you, exhaustion is not a status symbol.
Speaker 2:It shouldn't be. It's not a not you know, being fatigued or overspent, that's not a badge of honor. These days y'all, especially with the things we're going to face in this year, I mean, we're carrying a lot of things that are heavy. You know, we're worried about people we love and where our country is going, and so we've got to make that space to just take that deep breath and visualize how we want to show up in the essence of us, because it is so important that we are our best selves.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. By the time this episode drops, it will have already been announced. But I'm stepping away from the Women's Business Center. I made this decision a few weeks ago. I think it's beautiful timing because I didn't realize how this transition in our country was going to affect me emotionally, physically, like I woke up this morning and was like, can I even get out of this bed? Yeah, you know. And like having a little more space and time to really try to get to the root of, like, what is my purpose now?
Speaker 2:It's okay if it shifts a little bit, based on what you need to do for yourself, for your family, for other women for your community for the small business besties that you built.
Speaker 2:That is okay and you are in a very mature growth mindset and I commend you for that. I'm very, very proud of you. You know, first off, I did not know if we were going to talk about the state of our country. So rock on, yeah, high five, yeah yeah, but I'm, but I'm here for it, I'm ready to talk about it. I'm grateful for the position I'm in, where I own my own business and you know I am my own brand and you know whatever I say I'm responsible for. But it's me.
Speaker 2:And I even blogged about boycotting Thanksgiving this year and got some backlash for that. Knew I would Took a chance. Yeah, you know, and I had a really, really hard time with celebrating Thanksgiving and at a time that we celebrate immigrants coming in and you know we ended up getting rid of the Indians and really abusing the indigenous people of this land. And then we've got a president elect that is saying he's going to do similar things. I had a hard time and it was very healing for me to blog about it. It was very healing for me to have conversations like this about it.
Speaker 2:It's very healing for me in this moment, but I had somebody even say to me you know, I think you're just, I'm really proud of you for being in this self-care era, but I really think you need to think about you know how much how this can be hurtful or offensive to other people. And my propensity was oh, I'm so sorry, but I didn't, I didn't say, I sat with that a little bit and then I thought you know what? I am glad this person that loved me said I recognize you're in a self-care era. I have worked 41 years to be in a self-care era. You know what I mean Like as women. If you hope people can see that we're doing some self-care, because it is more important now than ever, right?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I just started reading Let them by Mel Robbins. I didn't even know who Mel Robbins was. She is a badass. I listened to a couple of her podcast episodes and then, honestly, I found out about the book because people were posting pictures of tattoos.
Speaker 2:Are they getting tattoos. I love it. Let them tattoos.
Speaker 1:And I was like what is this? And then I realized it was from a book. So I started listening to the book and talk about self-care, like you said, recognizing that like I'm going to get backlash for this, but let them back. And then let me make a decision to continue nurturing me.
Speaker 2:You are so right because I can look back at times in my life, especially leaving corporate, where I did what I knew was right and it felt so yucky yeah, was applauded and you know from a lot of my friends and I knew I was doing the right thing but felt so yucky as I've reflected a lot on that just in these last few weeks, what I've been doing is standing in my values. I've always had values, yeah, and values. We talk a lot about this. I'm an associate with Sutherland and Associates and we help businesses do strategic planning and identify their purpose, mission, vision and values and we talk a lot about values, and values are the behaviors and the guardrails that we put up on how we are going to act and what is okay and what isn't okay and how we say yes and no.
Speaker 2:I think now is more important than ever for people like you and me, and especially women, to know our values and stand by them and honor each other's values and know that that's okay. It's what we need to do, yeah, if we want positive change and we want to get through this next four years, let's stand in our values and we can be kind and compassionate about it. That's how we are. That's our value too. Right, but we don't have to agree with what we know is wrong. We have our inner knowing. We do not have to support what we know is wrong. Right, we can support each other, yeah.
Speaker 1:And that is enough right now. Yeah, and I think there's going to be a lot of decisions to be made on a regular basis over the next several years, of choices to be made of am I following my values right now, or am I going to go with the flow, go with the crowd, go with the you know, and I think that as we navigate, that's a good word these waters that lie ahead.
Speaker 1:It's going to be really important that we are supporting one another when we do stand up for our values, even if they're different than ours. You know and still love everybody give support.
Speaker 2:You know, something that I've really learned too because it's been hard when you're on opposite sides of what you believe on really, really big issues is that this has been a huge thing is you can love somebody with your whole heart and you can not respect their choice like love and respect aren't necessarily mutually exclusive Absolutely and you can still respect them for so many things and not. You know it's hard, it's hard, it's hard to understand and I don't, but I'm doing the best I can and that is enough. Yeah, and I'm standing in my values and that is enough. And if I can say that when I go to bed at night, then that's all I can ask of myself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I have work to do in that area because there are people in my life that I love wholeheartedly Same but I have very differing values when it comes to certain, especially political ideas. Right, now.
Speaker 1:And I'm finding it's more and more difficult to not respect their choice but to not lose respect for them as a person. Yeah, it's very difficult, you know, and that's not fair to those people. Respect for them as a person yeah, it's very difficult, you know, and that's not fair to those people. They don't deserve to feel disrespected by me as a person, even if I don't respect their choices, you know. So I definitely have some work around that to like how can I frame my feelings in a way that, like you still know I love you? Yes, you still know that I care, but I'm still know I love you? Yes, you still know that.
Speaker 2:I care.
Speaker 1:But I'm still allowed to disagree with yes, yes, yes.
Speaker 2:And I think it's okay to go into 2025 a little guarded. I'm all about being vulnerable. What you see is what you get with me. You know that is part of my brand and I love to be an open book, obviously speaking out a lot right now. But it's okay to be a little bit more protective. Yeah, because there's a lot of uncertainty. Yeah, and you know we have to sit in the uncertainty. That's the only way answers will come to us and that is so hard and that's been very hard. Circling back to just being an entrepreneur that's really hard, you know, when you have clients and you got to just hope that you're going to have them next month, you know. But really I like to say to myself relax, nothing is in control. Yes, and it's like OK, nothing is in control, I'm just going to do the best that I can. Oh, that's beautiful.
Speaker 1:I think I need that daily reminder. Relax, nothing is in control.
Speaker 2:I'm a control freak. We are type A and we love to take care of everybody and just make sure everything is perfect. But we can't. It's too exhausting. Yeah, learn to sit with not knowing we have to.
Speaker 1:All right, I'm going to take that to the float tank with me next time, please.
Speaker 2:Don't you love that. Do you go to float 859? I do. Or the float loft they, I do. Or the float loft They've rebranded. Yeah, I love Patrick and Amber, shout out to them. I go to the infrared sauna there. Yeah, I do. You float too. I have floated, but I just find more zen and infrared. Yeah, but now my husband floats and he loves it. Yeah, we're members, girl.
Speaker 1:I think that the floating and I've said this before on the podcast, because I'm a floataholic or whatever I don't do it nearly as much as I should, but it's such a far drive for us.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's so funny. And I live on that side of town. That's so funny. Yeah, I'm like man. I bet you feel that way about Hamburg too. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:Anyway, but with floating it's like it kind of comes in waves. When we owned the float spa, there was a period of time for like six months where I was floating like three or four times a week.
Speaker 1:I mean I couldn't get enough. I felt so inspired or rested or whatever I need going into that session that day. I always came out feeling it. And then there's like periods of like dry time where it's like I get in the float tank and I'm anxious, I'm miserable, I cannot be in here, you know, and I get nothing out of it. So I just have to kind of like ride that weight. It's kind of like meditation.
Speaker 2:Sometimes I'm a rock star at it and sometimes it's like is my 15 minutes up Because I can't even get to 14 minutes. Exactly, yes, it is exactly. But honestly, the busier we are, the more we need it, and it's hard but gosh, we need it.
Speaker 1:Self-care era on now. Yeah, strive for that, right? Yeah, I was. So I I talk a lot about therapy. I I therapize myself. Good love that. And I was talking with my therapist last week and I was like I just I feel like the only way that I'm gonna actually feel like I'm like in my body again, fully here and present again, is if I could just like turn everything off for like a good month, like no work, no kids, no spouse, no house, no groceries, no nothing. I just need to go unplug for like a good month, like no work, no kids, no spouse, no house, no groceries, no nothing. I just need to go unplug for like a whole month.
Speaker 2:Well, that's essentially what you do when you go float right, it's just not for a month. I know that's quite ambitious. I want that for you. I do too.
Speaker 1:Let me know how you do it. Yeah, if anybody knows a retreat center who's wanting to give away a free month stay, I'm gladly take it. Like I don't know podcast about my experience, but yeah, yeah, and she was like that's not realistic. You got to like rein it in a little, so figuring out what those little steps are that you could do. Like I can't have a full month at a retreat center, but I can. You can take a day. Yeah, start there. Exactly, I can have a self-care day on Fridays, absolutely.
Speaker 2:You know what I have tried to implement as an entrepreneur, because I can, because my boss is really cool and pretty. Thank you, oh, you're so sweet. That's because of the slap bracelet that looks so cute, and I learned this from, actually, the president of Sutherland Associates, megan Hollis-Flotter. She has what she calls flow Fridays, and so we try not to schedule meetings on Fridays, so that's when I make sure to go to Pilates and I catch up on anything that I didn't get done before, and I try to be done earlier in the day Sets my tone for the weekend, but it also is a gift to myself, yes, and so I challenge you to have Flow Fridays. It's been very helpful to me and that's one of the beautiful things about being your own boss Absolutely.
Speaker 2:You can schedule in a Flow Friday meeting with yourself. Nobody needs to know that the meeting is with yourself. You can have a very important meeting on Friday from, you know, 11 to 8 pm.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love that. What other tips do you have for, like, just being a badass woman entrepreneur?
Speaker 2:Well, I have my less and more list in front of me, in case that did come up because I thought, because I am trying to just really be intentional about this year and what I know works for me, yeah, and so I want to do less talking and more listening, because when someone talks to me and I do a lot of executive coaching and I'm actually going to be getting some coaching credentials this year, so I'm excited about that and get some more tools, because I love to just help women navigate there's our word again through life and that sort of thing. But I think women are fixers and nurturers and we want to fix it right away, and sometimes we need to say tell me more. Tell me more, yeah, because if you're like me, just talking it out really really helps. Another thing that is really really helped me is I want less brain clutter and more brain dumping, so things come in my head and I write them down and it makes absolutely no sense, you know, if you were looking at it and not be me, but that has really helped.
Speaker 2:There's something about putting it on paper that helps me get it done faster or helps me leave it there and come back. Yeah, so that's been helpful. And then less cramming things into my schedule and trying to do it all, and more padding time for the tasks that I know drain me. So I don't love a spreadsheet. I don't love to be on the computer a whole lot, but I have to be, and so sometimes I don't always give myself the adequate amount of time, and then I find myself stressed and then I'm working after five or six o'clock and then I'm mad and then I'm overwhelmed. So I need to budget time for things that I know will drain me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love the word you use there with the padding time, because I'm definitely guilty of not giving myself any space on my calendar between engagements. You know whether it's a task I need to do or an appointment.
Speaker 2:So what I'm trying to do? So a 30 minute meeting I'll schedule for an hour. Yes, so smart, yeah, that has really, really helped me, I bet AI can help us with that.
Speaker 1:to say, like, if I put an appointment on my calendar automatically at 15 minutes before and 30 minutes after, or whatever you know, whatever your need is, I bet it would automatically do that. You know, you told it.
Speaker 2:No, you know, yeah, you can do all the things. Thanks, Less self-doubt and more practicing what I preach because I'm so good at you know, building up other women.
Speaker 2:But then like and somebody called me out on this, last night even, and because I was like I just don't know if I'm going to be able to do this well this year, as I did last year on this and they were like OK, miss Manifestor, how dare you say that Like, you would never let me say that. Yeah, like, thank you for calling me out. I sent her a text today and thank her for calling me out. Yeah, so that's a big one.
Speaker 2:And then so I do, like I said, I do a lot of marketing and so inevitably, I do a lot of social media. You know the business part of it and I am going to do less social media throughout the day and more intentional, purposeful. Here's a certain amount of time I will give to social media for working. And then I got to let it go. Yeah, like, I haven't deleted it from my phone yet because sometimes when you have marketing clients, you got to make a quick change on social media or whatever. But I have put it three screens over on my. Yeah, less social media throughout the day and more intentional, schedule it and then be done with it.
Speaker 1:Schedule it. It's not worth my piece.
Speaker 2:It is not worth your piece and then be done with it, schedule it, because it's not worth my peace, it is not worth your peace. So I've got to, really, ladies, we got to protect our peace. Yeah, it's very important, and don't let anybody judge you for that. Nobody can tell you what your peace is. That's up to you.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, and it doesn't have to be the same as anybody.
Speaker 2:No, you're the only one that can make your life peaceful. Yeah, do what you gotta do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay.
Speaker 2:What other nuggets do you have for me, because I'm learning so much? Oh, you're so sweet, let's see. Okay, so I do love the eat the frog method. I do too. Okay, so I want to do that more, though, because every time I do I'm so glad. Okay, but I don't find myself doing it. So eat the frog is you take the thing that you are dreading more than anything else, and you do it first thing in the morning, and then you feel amazing the rest of the day. Right, yeah, just eat that for all.
Speaker 1:We're going through that with my daughter right now. She just turned six. She's having a real like I am my own boss, I am a boss of me. Okay, you know what I mean. Love that her, but that means that we sit at the dinner table and she's like I refuse to eat the thing, whatever. Every day there's a thing. There's a thing she refuses.
Speaker 2:She loves. No, I'm just, she just likes the act of refusing. Yeah, I don't like that. I don't love that about her. She should be able to say no. But also Nutrients, yeah, yeah, that is important and respect. You know, mama cooked this.
Speaker 1:You're still living under this roof, yeah, but that's been my theory with her lately. It's like, okay, what do you not want on this plate, like the sweet potato? And I'm like, okay, yeah, take three bites of sweet potato, yeah, and then you can have everything else on the plate. You don't have to have some good, negotiating hasn't worked yet. Okay, it's just a lot of arguing, crying. Nutrients are important. You know she needs that beta carotene or one day she One day. She's going to understand.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for her Something yeah something good.
Speaker 1:Just trust me. I love it the rainbow kid, and not like Fruity Pebbles, please.
Speaker 2:Love it, I love it. Anyway, I love it. So those are some of my less and more, but as far as like overall, like macro things, I would have known in my earlier days to take care of myself. So one is and let's go back to woo-woo for just a minute I love it there. Do you know your human design? I have no idea.
Speaker 2:Okay so, human design you can go online and do the free test. There's like five different ones. It has been so incredibly validating for me. Okay, so I'm a projector. There's so many things it's been able to articulate and I I've learned about myself, like we need more rest and we tend to take in more emotion. But we make really good guides, which we got that. We make really good coaches. I mean, it has been so good for me. Ok, so I can't wait to see what you are. Oh yeah, generator and a manifesting generator and a reflector and a projector and something else Fascinating. I can't wait, loved it. Ok, so I did that. Something else Fascinating I can't wait, loved it. Okay, so I did that. Another thing that I have done. That I did, ironically, after I left corporate because I had time to take care of myself and I just kind of did it for shits and giggles is I got my hormones checked. Yeah, girl, I wish I would have done this in my early 30s.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Because I had okay. So let me just give you an example. So, to feel good, a woman who was my age at the time I was 38 at the time testosterone level needs to be 150 or above. Mine was at 32. Oh to my OBGYN and my general practitioner about that. They were just like you're, just stressed because I did have some stressful jobs. Let's put you on some more Lexapro, and don't get me wrong, lexapro should be in the water. I'm all about people taking Lexapro, but it did not help. What I was needing help, which is so much energy and just so many things. And I get testosterone pellets now and it has been life changing in so many ways. Just amazing. It has been life-changing in so many ways. Just amazing, yes, just how I feel and how balanced I am and just all kinds of things.
Speaker 2:Okay, so those are two big things that I really feel.
Speaker 1:Did you get your testosterone or your hormones checked through your like? No, PCP?
Speaker 2:No, okay, she never offered to do that. I love her and I've been with her forever and she's a great clinician. But no, I went to at the time it was the Tony Delk Clinic, and then I went to Wellward and now I go to Solutions Functional Medicine and they're just amazing. I mean, it is all about body chemistry and mine was so off, so you don't have to wait till you're 60 before you start looking at your hormones Like it can be off.
Speaker 1:I'm super excited. I just signed up with Journey Health with Nicole Perkins. Yeah, we're in Lexington and I have an appointment next week and I'm like run all the tests.
Speaker 2:Yeah, To so many things. I mean so holistic, you know, like they just take so much into consideration. We don't underestimate what food and nutrients and exercise and all these environmental factors and everything can do and we need to feel good. Yeah, we really do, I want quality of life Absolutely. But yeah, we really do, I want quality of life Absolutely. So, yeah, that's been a big thing. That's really helped me feel better physically and I never thought I would say this, but I do Pilates now, yeah, and I was always kind of scared of that and it has been the best thing for me. Why were you scared? Because it's like this big machine. It's called a performer and it just does all this and I thought it was just like to. You know, masculine and scary. And wait, no, it is amazing.
Speaker 2:And I go to this place called Mind Over Body downtown. You should have to interview Melissa, call me. She's amazing. It is such a great community. The classes are six people or less. You get so much one on one attention and I have never been stronger. Love that. It's been perfect for this time in my life. It's not too much cardio. Yeah, I love the cardio.
Speaker 1:Some people do good for you, but I just want to be stronger yeah, I've got surgery coming up at the end of the month so I'm trying to like get a bunch of strength training before this. I know, for a good solid couple of weeks I'm not going to be able to do anything, okay, you know, body strength wise, I think that I'm at a point in my life where I've been going to Orange Theory, love Orange Theory Good, I'm definitely a part of that. Yeah, orange cult, yeah, that's great, yeah. But I think I'm at a place right now, emotionally, physically, everything, where I'm like I need less of that like raw energy that Orange Theory brings and more of the like yoga bodies like come into my body.
Speaker 2:There's a reason. The place I go, so the place I go is called Mind Over Body. Yeah, so much is about the mind.
Speaker 1:Yes, you know.
Speaker 2:Slow down and be yes. They're saying slow down all the time, so I'm like I want to go in there and like get this done and get like you know 15. No, no, it's not what it's about. Yeah, about controlled rib. Pilates has been a game changer for me. Love that, yeah, okay, yeah. So those are just some of the things I've done to make myself feel better. Yeah, and I do not take it for granted that you know, I'm able to go to a pilates class in the middle of the day as an entrepreneur because I can make my own schedule. Yeah, but that is one of the great things about, yeah, having your own business.
Speaker 1:yeah, I mean, there's always that like balance. If you will pros, pros or cons, you know like, yeah, you can, you can absolutely control your schedule, and if you want to go to a Pilates class in the middle of the day, that's great. But then the other side of that is, if I make that choice, you know, am I still going to be able to generate the revenue or generate reach or all of that? So you're always like balancing those things, but if you're not taking care of yourself, ladies, take it from me, you will burn out. You will get to a point where you say I am physically, mentally, emotionally exhausted.
Speaker 2:I used to roll my eyes when people would say you know the whole cup. What is the whole cup thing? You can't fill someone, you can't pour from an empty cup, so yours needs to be full. And I was just like no, I can be a badass empty cup Like.
Speaker 2:I'm fine, no-transcript partner, I'm so fortunate. But when I left my husband said the brow, the furrow in my brow, you know, relaxed, and my shoulders it was taking a toll on me that I had no idea. And so you mentioned burnout. We don't even realize we're getting there until sometimes it's too late. And so we really have to work on not telling ourselves I can do it all and I need to do it all and I need to be exhausted and I need to climb the ladder. We have got to take care of ourselves now more than any other time. We got a lot to do. Absolutely, we need to pace ourselves and support one another and prioritize, prioritizing each other.
Speaker 1:Right and remembering that life can be fun. It should be fun. Life is allowed to be fun.
Speaker 2:It should be fun and there's nothing wrong with that. You're exactly right. I had coffee with Elizabeth Bagby before this and she knows you and she was so excited. It couldn't have been any better for me to have a meeting with her and then get to talk with you. I was like you are getting me ready to meet with Adele, but she called me out last year we were taking a walk and I said something like you know, now that I'm an entrepreneur and I'm doing all this stuff, I feel a little guilty because a lot of the things that I'm getting to do and the projects and the things I'm getting paid for, I'm getting to do with some of my best friends.
Speaker 2:I said that and she said and I will never forget this, I'm going to need to call you out on that if you don't mind. And I said what do you mean? She goes. You just said you feel guilty because you're getting to work with some of your best friends. She's so right though, like it is okay, it is. How lucky am I, you know, to get to choose who I work with and what we do? Yeah, it should be fun. We have got to work on the guilt y'all. Guilt is just a form of control, it is, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and also like to build on what she said to you, though, like not only should you not feel guilty for it, but you should take a little credit for that.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, you know you're not lucky that you get to do that Build the life you always imagined. You've worked hard for that. Congratulations to you too. Look at us, look at us. Good gravy, I can remember talking with you at a luncheon and you were just getting started with the small business besties and you got a little emotional, saying I just feel so honored. Yeah, you know, I still do. I know and, and I think you know, your whole mindset and attitude about the work that you're doing is on point and I want that for every woman because, first off, gratitude is so important and I think you know the only way that we can truly just like enter into the divine love and just being one with what's around us is to just constantly pour out gratitude. Yeah, okay, it doesn't mean we have to, you know, take shit from people, but there is always something to be thankful for, and I make it my practice to write my gratitude every day before I write my to-do list, and it is so helpful.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I ordered a new journal for the new year. I was finding that it was hard for me to like really journal. Yeah, you know, like I haven't just sat there and stared at the page. I'm like, yeah, it's not gonna come today, so I just give up. Uh, so I ordered this one. It's called the five minute journal. It's super popular. It's five, yeah, exactly, but it's basically it's gratitude. It's like what are you thankful for? What are you looking looking forward to what went really well?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I changed my list too. I made my own journal. I changed this to everything I get to do instead of everything I have to do, yeah, and then I mark what has to be done today. I have a daily affirmation Someone I have to reach out to. What I'm learning and my messy about it. See, wait.
Speaker 2:So you made, I did, I did jess up church king gave me one that she made, that she sells, which is awesome, and I used it for several years, and now I I needed to make my own, just because I I just needed to organize it a little bit differently, and that has it's helped me so much. I saw the one that jess jess's is awesome. Yeah, is it? Yeah, I, I.
Speaker 1:That's what inspired this I think my like, uh, squirrel brain got the better of me because I was looking at Jess's and I think this is what happened. I was like oh, I want that journal. Yeah, oh, let me look at the sweatshirts, oh, let me look at that. And then something happened. I put my phone down.
Speaker 2:So much good merch at her event. I'm so proud of her.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I want to go to Uganda, you. I want to go to Uganda, you're going to go to Uganda, I'm going to go to Uganda. It'll be so good.
Speaker 1:I can't wait yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so good, you guys can come with us. Yeah, yeah, but she needs to know ASAP, because she's making a living, oh my gosh, it's going to be so good, it's going to be so impactful. I think that I've things in perspective for us a little bit. I just want to go love on those moms Especially. I know a lot of people want to play with the girls and do things, but I just want to love on those moms.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, it's going to be good. I'm really looking forward to it Finding out how I can be of best service, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:But writing down your gratitude. I think it's so important, even if you just write five things, just write them down, it really rewires your brain to think more positively and set your day. Yeah, so simple.
Speaker 1:It is. We don't, you know, we, we don't make a habit of doing so, so I'm going to tell you I need, I need to, I need a life coach again. Okay, you know, I thought like I, I was in coaching for a while. I was in group coaching, I was in one-on-one coaching, I was, you know, and I get therapy and I do all the things. And it's like, all right, I have arrived, I am good, right, I do this by myself now. And you know, I did not.
Speaker 1:It's like I crashed and burned, not like I'm, you know, flailing around or whatever, but like all of those practices that I had built through the coaching, the gratitude journaling and the like, setting my intention and all of those things you know. I think that as soon as I got out of coaching, it was like, okay, well, I've got all this great knowledge, now I have to put it, like, into practice. But instead of continuing the practice, I was like I'm just going to make you know all the money that I can make. Okay, you, I was like I'm just going to make you know all the money that I can make. Okay, you know. Like, I have to make sure that I not that I'm like a greedy person? No, but you have to provide for your family and your goals.
Speaker 1:Yeah, got it Like grow this business. And you know, once we get to X point with the business, then we can bring on this many people. And you know like then the impact becomes even more because we are making money. And I got so focused on that, that like me and what I need. I got so lost in all of that.
Speaker 2:Fortunately. This is why we call it a practice. It's never going to be perfect and forget the whole practice makes perfect, because we're never going to get there, we're never going to be perfect humans, and if we think that, then we're just selling, setting ourself up for failure, really, really. But I do think a coach or an accountability partner or whatever you want to call it and some people need that or find that through therapy. I love my therapist. I've seen him for 15 years and don't see him on a regular basis, but he's there when I need him. Yeah, wonderful. But I do think a coach or an accountability partner is important and there is nothing wrong with the fact that one time you were really great and you saw the benefits of it and then now you might need it again. Yeah, again. That is why we call it a practice.
Speaker 1:Yeah, my yoga teacher used to talk about it, about going up the mountain, and he was, like you know, especially as yogis like if you backslide right, you're going up the mountain, you're really into your practice, you're sitting in meditation, you're doing all the things and then, if you like, come off that practice and you kind of slide back down the mountain a little.
Speaker 2:It's really hard sometimes to like acknowledge or to admit.
Speaker 1:I guess to admit like, hey, you just need somebody to extend their hand, Like I haven't been on my mat for six months and I feel really bad about that, and like we get this idea that there's gonna be shame and guilt associated with it and all that.
Speaker 2:About shame for a second. I love some Brene Brown. Thank you, brene Brown, for bringing shame to the surface, because I think we as women and I'm sure you can relate have suffered more from shame than anything else. As far as, like internal, unnecessary suffering, yeah, when our girlfriends are displaying it and we got to call them on it because nobody should suffer, like life is not made to suffer. You know, shame should not be shame and guilt should not be part of our everyday feelings, like it's just not worth it. Yeah, you know so. I think anybody would be so. Any coach would just love to coach you. You would be a gift to anybody that was able to. And I think too, as coaches, we need coaches Absolutely, and that is one of my goals too, if I'm going to be really serious about getting my credentials and doing more coaching.
Speaker 1:I'm going to get a coach this year too, yeah, that's amazing, yeah, yeah, I think it's like it's easy for us to kind of or maybe it's not for me it's very easy to like kind of compartmentalize, like my business life is over here and my personal life is over here and, like the, the idea that, like a business coach is going to help you just with your business, right, bananas, because most of the time it, you know, translates over and vice versa.
Speaker 1:So when I was getting a lot of life coaching, my business was going really well because my life, my house, so to speak, like my internal house, was in order. Yeah, you know because know, because your cup was filled.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you were a better badass, boss, bestie, whatever you know, you know, leader, owner, whatever you want to call yourself, you were better because you were taking care of you. Yeah, back to that self-care again. Back to self-care again. Here we are. There's nothing wrong in it. There's no shame in self-care, it's necessary. I just want women to get to that point so much earlier than I did in my life. And if you're not there and you're my age or older than me, like I challenge you let's put self-care as a priority, because we are going to love the people and care for the people that mean the most to us.
Speaker 1:So much better if we are cared for Absolutely so much wisdom.
Speaker 2:That's my 2025 word. Oh, I forgot. I thought maybe you didn't and said it, but I'm glad that you did forget. Just shows the universe is aligned, it's true.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. I appreciate you sharing all of the tidbits.
Speaker 2:I appreciate you holding space for me today, like I had no idea that this is what was going to happen, but I'm so incredibly grateful for you too, and I'm I am grateful for your honesty, like within the first couple minutes, when I was just literally walking into your studio, of like hey, today's a tough day. Thank you, like I love to get real deep, real quick, because it set the whole tone for our conversation and we've been brave, we've been brave.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we, we love everybody out there and we, we are doing the best that we can. Yeah, and we love everybody out there and we are doing the best that we can. Yeah, and that is enough. That is enough and relax. Nothing is in control.
Speaker 1:Nothing is in control and, honestly, if anybody hears this and thinks I need people who can give me that space, Like I'm not a therapist but if you need somebody to be safe with, I have you.
Speaker 2:They need to be following small business besties, devonnie Inclusive, and know that we are going to give them all the sparkle and love and acceptance.
Speaker 1:And the Love.
Speaker 2:Club. Oh, and the Love Club, and the Love Club. She just shout out Savannah. Yes, is it January 30th? I believe that we're going to. It's just going to start doing it every Friday. Yeah, it we're gonna. It's just gonna start doing it every friday. Yeah, last friday every month thank you, so excited about that talk about just a really great creative group yeah, in a space where you can just I'm savannah I went to the my first co-working last month. I missed that one, and I hated to miss it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was exactly what I needed that day, I mean. And I and I told her, I said I'm going to make this a habit from now on and I think that it's. It's like a perfect, like marriage, if you will. You know, the small business besties group is like a lot of entrepreneurs that we're trying to be like kind of business focused, and then Savannah is like just so bold and saying like this is just the love club.
Speaker 2:Like, if you need a place to be here, we are here. We are. The energy there is so great. I have loved working with her. She's actually on the Devon Inc team. We've got several clients that we share in common and I get so giddy with excitement whenever I get to work with her. She is, she's so wonderful. When I went out on my own as an entrepreneur, we met at Kenwick tables first time I'd ever been there and I said I don't know if I can do this. And she goes no, I think you can do it. No, you can do it. Like I will never forget her saying that and I did it. I mean, look at us now and I mean she is doing so much good stuff. And, yeah, love Club, love Club, small Business Besties, devon Inclusive, love Club. Please, a thousand more. We are here, you are not alone.
Speaker 1:We're not alone, absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 2:Oh, I just love you dearly. I love you. Thank you for this absolutely, and thank you for this slap bracelet that's going to continue to bring me joy oh, I'm so glad.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we'll make sure to link out to all of your social media, your website, your linkedin, anything else that you want linked. Just let us know. But you guys please follow along. I know that everybody who listens to small mrs bestie knows you loves you. Oh, I don well, but y'all share I appreciate that.
Speaker 2:Thank you, Give her some love With a name like Devonna. You know there's not a lot of us out there, so I appreciate it. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1:Well, welcome to 41. Thank you, and let's take 2025 and make it ours. They can't have it. We are talk to you guys later.